US defense chief says he used cluster bombs during military service

By Michael Hernandez

WASHINGTON (AA) - US Defense Secretary Lloyd Austin said in remarks aired Friday that he personally used cluster munitions in combat during his four decades of military service.

Asked during a CNN interview if he knows of the dangers associated with the weapons, Austin said "I do, Wolf. I know how these munitions work. I actually used them in combat." He was referring to CNN host Wolf Blitzer who conducted the interview on the sidelines of this week's NATO summit in Lithuania.

It is unclear at what point in Austin's 41-year military career he used the weapons, but he served in the Army’s 3rd Infantry Division during the 2003 invasion of Iraq. The Pentagon has said that conflict is the last time on record that the US employed cluster munitions like those supplied to Ukraine.

The US has come under criticism for its decision to supply Ukraine with cluster munitions, including from close NATO allies who have outlawed their development and use.

The decision came as Ukraine pushes its counteroffensive seeking to oust Russia from Ukrainian territories it now occupies in a bid to force Moscow to come to the negotiating table to broker an end to the year-and-a-half conflict.

In 2008, more than 100 countries signed a convention to ban the production, stockpiling, use and transfer of cluster bombs, which release large numbers of smaller bomblets that can kill indiscriminately over a wide area.

"Dud" munitions, or bomblets that fail to explode as intended have killed and maimed civilians across a wide swathe of battlefields where they have been employed, sometimes decades after they are initially used.

That has been particularly true in Southeast Asia where the US dropped hundreds of millions of cluster bombs during the Vietnam War.
Austin said that as part of the transfer of US cluster bombs to Ukraine, Kyiv agreed to keep track of its use of the bombs, refrain from using them in civilian areas, and execute de-mining operations once the situation allows.

"The Ukrainians have committed, in writing, to make sure that these munitions are used only in the appropriate places, not used and against population centers. They will record the places that they use them, and they will prioritize de-mining efforts, and we'll help them do that in those places where they use these munitions," he said.

Austin demurred when asking how long the US would continue to supply Ukraine with the weapons, saying: "We're going to stay focused on making sure that they have what they need to continue to provide the support for their maneuver."